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Adding point on route extends route back from the end

Saturday 18 June
by Ivars
in forum cycle.travel
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I was trying to create a route from Newcastle upon Tyne to Hull (part of a longer route) but wanted to follow more of the coast, as the Euro-Velo 12 route does, than what Cycle Travel suggested. Therefore  I added a point at  Scarborough which is on the EV 12 route. The Cycle Travel route maintains the original route to Hull but adds a section back to Scarborough. 

How can I adjust the route so that Scarborough is on the route to Hull not in addition to the route to Hull?I only have an iPad or iPhone to do my route planning, Using the tool on a desktop seems more flexible but not an option since I’m on a 4 month bike tour. 

Thanks. 

Comments

Sat 18 Jun, 21:37

Do you have any other waypoints on the map? If so remove any that seem to be constraining the route to go to Hull first. if necessary add waypoints to pin the route towards Scarborough. Advice based on desktop use I am afraid.

Sun 19 Jun, 09:45

I did not have any additional waypoints. Start at Newcastle, end at Hull, with one additional point at Scarborough. It treats Scarborough as an extension of the route instead of an adjustment to the route.

It would be nice to be able to constrain the selected end point to remain the end point. Some similar route planning tools differentiate between “extend route” and “modify route”.  

By adding additional waypoints along the coastal route I could eventually get the routing to be closer to the EV12 route but fundamentally I still have problems with the tool deciding to extend the route for some points but not for others. Sometimes the extension is ridiculous, with a waypoint added near the start resulting in a route back from the end!

Sun 19 Jun, 12:23

Could try try creating a route from Newcastle to Scarborough then adding a point at Hull?

Sun 19 Jun, 17:49

Creating the route from Newcastle to Scarborough first and then adding a point to Hull does work but my initial question was really more about the general behaviour of the routing algorithm than the specific route. 

My expectations was that adding an intermediary waypoint such as Scarborough would adjust the route to pass through it instead of extending the route. It seems odd that the algorithm considers a much longer route better than a shorter one. Perhaps it is trying to create a loop route instead of a point to point one. 

When I plan a longer route such as Newcastle to Portsmouth, adding waypoints such as Milton Keynes behaves as I expect. 

I’m looking forward to the iOS app. Hopefully it will be available before my tour ends. 

Sun 19 Jun, 19:12

How about creating the route from Newcastle to Hull, then adding a via point anywhere along this route. Finally, drag this via point to Scarborough and the whole route should shift eastwards.

Sun 19 Jun, 22:40

Interesting, I just asked for a route from Newcastle to Hull, then added a via point at Scarborough, using the 'Add at', then typing a name in the box, and got a route Newcastle-Scarborough-Hull:  

https://cycle.travel/map/journey/330709

But this was on a desktop, Mac OS X and Safari, not an iPad or iPhone.

Mon 20 Jun, 11:21

I've just plotted a route from Newcastle upon Tyne to Hull and then added a waypoint at Scarborough on both my desktop computer and my iPhone. Both worked fine and the routing is supposed to do what you expected. Occasionally errors with the open source map cause anomalies, however these are of a local nature, and caused because the error makes a particular point unroutable. It's hard to know why you had the experience you did, without having access to the saved route. What i will say is that I personally find using waypoints on the iPhone is tricky - however I'm assuming the waypoint dropped correctly.

I expect the only way to get the bottom of this is for you to post the saved route number. However I don't know how that is done from a mobile device as the route number doesn't appear on the screen.

Mon 20 Jun, 12:17

With the help of everyone’s comments, I’ve been able to figure out how to get the routing to work as I expect. 

The key was Martin’s comment about adding a via point on the track and then dragging it to where I want. That works beautifully on a mobile device and does not have the (occasional) weird behaviour of adding a point by name. Even though I had read the help pages, I missed this method. 

Thanks for everyone’s help. 

Mon 20 Jun, 13:19

Spot on – to add a mid-point on mobile, the easiest thing to do is double-click somewhere on the route to create a new via point, then drag that to Scarborough.

If you want to just follow an existing route, you can also go to the map of routes (click ‘Route guides’ > ‘Browse all routes on a map’) and find it there. Click through to open it in the route-planner, then trim/edit to suit.

In truth I do struggle with how to handle extra clicks/taps to extend a route! Originally cycle.travel would add the point mid-route if you clicked somewhere near the route, but in practice that seemed to confuse people. Currently it will (broadly) extend it from the start if your click is closer to the existing start, or from the end if your click is closer to the existing end. But I think a lot of people expect it to always extend from the end. I’m wondering about changing to that for simplicity and consistency.

Thu 23 Jun, 11:18

Richard, the last thing I want to seem is critical but I wonder if it's time to write out a user's manual? There have been so many improvements and additions that it I'd be confident that longer term users are using CT differently to new users. I've never used the "Add viapoint" procedure except by clicking on the route, as an example.

Coming back to CT after a period I've had a chance to relearn and keep finding new features. Writing notes to myself on a viapoint is the latest! 

I know it's more work and time. Sorry. :-)

Maybe it could be divvied up amongst the community?