Hi Jesse – this looks like an issue with Patreon. I’ve raised a ticket with them and will get back to you as soon as I hear anything. Sorry for the hassle.

A bit misleading then. The published fees should include VAT or at least say that you have to pay an additional 20%.

Meanwhile cycle.travel still doesn’t even show I’ve paid.🙁

A bit misleading then. The published fees should include VAT or at least say that you have to pay an additional 20%.

To be fair to Richard and to allay any nervousness people might have about Patreon the subscription page and especially the 'Order Summary' section clearly shows the Vat amount. 

There is the possibility to edit the amount of support, lowering the amount CT receives so that the total (including VAT) is what you expect it to be, 

It’s curious this Patreon business. Is there really no other platform that’s simpler and more familiar for folks in the UK and more in line with UK best practice? I’ve steered away from supporting ‘creators’ in the past if they were using Patreon to get paid. The dubious stuff about Patreon on Wikipedia was enough to turn me off, but I’d never actually used it before.

I naively assumed I could make a one-off payment of £24 to cycle.travel and then see how the added benefits of the subscription worked. So far, Patreon have taken £28.80 off me, and nothing has changed with cycle.travel. I am still only getting the free version of the app with none of the benefits of subscribing. I think I know what’s causing the hiccup, and it’s a pretty poor show.

I also didn’t realise that by making this payment Patreon would not only store my card details but also set up the subscription for auto-renewal. I don’t recall seeing anywhere an obvious way to opt out of auto-renewal nor any simple and obvious way to delete my card details without deleting the account.

I suppose Richard and many of his subscribers are used to this kind of arrangement and happy with it, but I find it unsatisfactory. I’m sure I am not alone and sure the affiliation with Patreon has turned off other potential supporters.

It’s curious this Patreon business

What is? Please be specific.

Is there really no other platform that’s simpler and more familiar for folks in the UK and more in line with UK best practice?

What is 'UK best practice'? Again, please be specific. 

What online platform do you suggest that will process payments securely for international supporters and allow the 'creator' to communicate directly with the supporters?

You do realise that some of us are not in the UK?

The dubious stuff about Patreon on Wikipedia was enough to turn me off

Again, could you please be specific about the 'dubious stuff'. Patreon accidentally 'shared' some data back in 2015 but has been secure since. 

I'm sure you'll have read the commission rates that CT has to pay to Patreon. Do you not think if there was a 'better' alternative that it would be used? 

I find it unsatisfactory

What is unsatisfactory? Specifics please.

Please stop and have a think about your posts and the possible effect they may have, especially the lack of specificity of your assertions. It appears that the VAT addition was overlooked. Where does the responsibility lie for that? It does not strike me as some kind of moneygrab. 

CycleTravel is a one man operation. Once you get access to your supporter benefits you'll be able to read the monthlyish ,-) updates and see how much work goes on 'under the hood' and behind the scenes. On this forum - even on this thread - you'll see direct engagement from Richard. 

Yes, it's frustrating that your support is suffering a glitch and that you are not currently seeing the benefits of it. The situation is being worked on. I think the real issue here, however,  is an unfamiliarity with online payments and a sense of unease from that. My suggestion, respectfully made, is to familiarise yourself with the area and use whatever safeguards you think are appropriate. Myself, my Patreon payment goes from a Paypal account that is funded by a tightly controlled card. In a 'worst case scenario' my exposure is limited. I also check, double check and triple check amounts and addresses before pressing 'Confirm'. The last time I didn't do that my order of books ended up in the wrong country! :-) 

Finally, I'd agree that some people will be turned off as a supporter by Patreon (or whatever online payment processor is used) because of a lack of information that manifests as anxiety. I'm also pretty sure that many people don't ride their bikes 'over there' for the exact same reason. As a former member of that latter group I say: their loss. 

Mr Hobbes, I don't want to get into a silly slinging match with you over Patreon. The BBC revealed that child pornographers have used the site to get paid. There are other serious allegations against Patreon. The information is out there in the public domain and easy enough to find if you don't trust Wikipedia. 

The number of suitable payment processors is actually pretty low because it needs to be a Merchant of Record (i.e. one that does the sales tax work) which has a pricing structure suitable for small monthly payments. Most MORs are more geared up for software that costs £50/month, not £2. It is something I keep under review, but setting up a new processor wouldn’t be trivial because of the integration work, including setting up an additional process for sending the newsletter every month.

If you don’t like Patreon, you can of course always use the iPhone or Android apps, where payments are processed by Apple or Google respectively. The benefits are the same (both in the app and on the website) – the only difference is that the newsletter appears in the app rather than being emailed to you.

For any questions about individual accounts or payments I’d suggest emailing me directly at info@cycle.travel so it can be sorted out.

Thanks Richard. Didn't realise you could be contacted directly. It looked like any issues with an account had to be raised here. I wasn't comfortable starting this thread but couldn't see how to get this issue resolved otherwise. Also didn't realise a one-off payment could be made through the mobile app. I thought it was subscription only through Patreon. I'll look into that next time. Anyway, sorry for the bother. Please feel free to lock or remove this thread.

For anyone anxious about the transparency of payment and the possibility of getting hit with VAT (or a sales tax) this is the screen that we face when signing up.